After writing a grammatical exposition of the controversial passage in Matthew which Catholics claim shows Peter is their Pope, Claudius the Catholic said,
“Now that I have all that grammar out of the way we need to all sit and think about what this all means.”
Sure, now let’s look at your second statement after that one:
“We have the prophecy from Daniel that the Catholic Church fulfills”
So then rather than sticking with that passage you jump thousands of years back to Daniel, well if you can do that I can also refer to other Scriptures on whether or not the Catholic Church is the true Church or not. I’m guessing you’re talking about Daniel 2, being that this is the only speech I could find on the net from a Catholic claiming that D2 supported Catholicism,
“It refutes the Protestant and Mormon notion of a “Great Apostasy.” Believers in a Great Apostasy believe that at some point, either Catholicism replaced the True Church, or overran it. Yet Daniel 2′s prophesy says that during the days of the Roman Empire, Christ will set up a Kingdom, and it’ll never “be left to another people.” There’s no room for a New Church or New Kingdom in a post-Roman age (in either sense of “Roman,” there). No need to hypothesize about who the first pope was, or when the Church was formed. Daniel 2 lays the foundation you need, and the New Testament clears up the gray areas.”
The problem with this part of the Catholic’s rant are obvious:
1) The Bible says there will be an apostasy in the New Testament, more than once. So this Catholic like so many others just doesn’t know, forgets or deliberately avoids certain Scripture.
2) He’s forgetting yet another Scripture in which Jesus said that his kingdom should not be awaited, but that it was already here. OBVIOUSLY, there was no Catholic Church at that time, and if Peter was the first pope, he sure wasn’t at that time. So out goes that massive stretch.
3) The Roman Catholic church is not a kingdom. And Revelation does say the Catholic church whores about with them (“seven mountains”, don’t forget).
4) That line about the church not being left to another people as evidence is utterly stupid and infantile and nonsensical: A protestant could easily make that claim as evidence, what does it prove? “Hi, Bible says my church won’t be left to another people, so you Catholics aren’t the true church.” WOW EXCELLENT PROOF! NOT. Really how stupid can you get Catholics? Why not say, “Bible says Jesus is the Christ, that’s means our Christ, so you’re not the real Christians.” Wow, awesome, proved sooo much. Might as well say, “Nanny nanny boo boo we are true not you.”
Yet, if I and other Christians don’t read Catholic arguments like that, we face replies like, “Nanny nanny boo boo I can’t hear you.” (referring to us). But no: we don’t have to endlessly read Catholic claims and defenses, once you read their some of their common replies and claims as to why they are the true Church, whether it has an official stamp of of approval from their Pope or not, and review their TRUE history, whether it has the official seal of approval from their Pope or not, and see the flaws in them, whether their Pope acknowledges them or not, that is enough ignore the Nanny Boo Booers who just want to torment you more for not following them.
What makes the other people claim so ultra stupid, is that it makes no point and the Catholic using it is implying that it’s true just because he says it is (based on his claim that Kingdom = Catholic Church). How is that better than the Mormon babble that he claims is false? Better than their “oh Jesus said he has ‘other sheep’ and ‘other sheep’ is the Indians, bcuz the Book of Mormon said so. Just trust your good heart we’re right, and pray too so you can trust more, and if you don’t trust, well then you must be wrong, because we can see the truth no matter what you say, and truth is our hearts tell us we’re right, and the Book of Mormon too.” Vain, stretched, contrived, absurd, circles.
Moving on, what about Revelation? Why do Catholics keep avoiding that Book? The Catholic Church is CLEARLY being referred to in Revelation, CLEARLY fulfills the prophecy of the whore that rides the beast and the reference to the seven mountains makes it almost plain. No other entity fits that prophecy, despite the repeated fallacy made by Catholics when they refer to Protestants as a single entity, even though they contract themselves by trumping up the divisions between them! You can’t have it both ways Arbitrary Church.
Concerning the grammar? As usual, we only need to refer to other passages of Scripture. Over and over God and Jesus are called the Rock of eternity, and Jesus the foundation. ALL the apostles are referred to as the foundation, not just Peter, and obviously God does not mean bedrock it’s on or whatever is holding the foundation together (obviously that would be God, not Peter or the apostles). And anyone who has studied Protestant arguments on this matter, if they aren’t a newbie, knows the argument that Peter does not nearly contribute as much as Paul did, and it would make more sense to call Paul the foundation of the church. Peter supplemented Paul, not the other way around. So then it’s not unreasonable just based on that fact that Jesus wasn’t calling Peter a cornerstone or secondary foundation and the apostles playing inferior roles. Another Protestant argument is that Jesus pointed to himself, which some Catholics think absurd or unrealistic. BUT IT ISN’T, because Jesus gave a riddle to the Pharisees in which it clearly states he was referring to himself, rather than what they thought he, to them, appeared to LITERALLY mean, and so Catholics are being arbitrary with how they are literally interpreting the “and on this rock” passage. Further, NOTHING in that verse says anything about Peter being a Pope, or that the Catholic Church is the true Church. Any idiot can proclaim, “Peter was our pope, here’s proof: other members of the Catholic Church agree” or “Oh these Christians said so” and NOT bring up the CHARACTER of those people they use as witnesses, something clearly not Biblical to do. You don’t just trust anyone, that is ARBITRARY, it’s “picking and choosing”. It’s evil. And Catholics hate to hear this:
“By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?”
Do I even need to start pointing out the severe corruption in your Church? Do I need to point out the hypocrisy of your church in venerating Mother Teresa, or electing one corrupt Pope after another? The abortion rates? The rapes? And that other evil you all know is a problem?
But the arbitrary Catholic defense to that is, “Everybody sins dupe de dupe.” Oh yes, you’re right, “no biggie”, “everyone does it,” “But Dad, Johnny Calvin also put his hands in the cookie jars, so look at him not us, and just keep letting us sin.” And you sure can’t speak of Protestants as a single entity, because as you yourselves say of us, “Oh you Protestants are evil terrible horrible, ur the evil doers!” Because as you yourselves say, “They are divided into so many Churches! They can’t all have the Holy Spirit!” Yes, you’re right, they can’t all, and you are included among the division, or did you forget the Protestants DIVIDED from you? Once again: Arbitrary Arguing. And so, answer your own question, judge for yourselves, if not all can have the Holy Spirit, then who does? Maybe instead of repeatedly looking in the mirror and make vain repetitions to convince yourselves that it’s you who have it, like narcissists, maybe examine the deeds of other churches, maybe consider the true Church doesn’t go by a single name, like a business corporation, some magic name that makes you saved, some magical club name, but that they can be KNOWN BY THEIR FRUITS, their deeds, not “A NAME.”
I’ve read Robert Sungenis’ argument on the “Petra/Petros” argument too, and found his argument nonsensical and contradictory. James White does too:
And one last thing, the Bible forbids logomachy (arguing over words), which is what you Catholics are doing when you strive over petra and petros, and put into question the trustworthiness of Scripture like Muslims and Mormons do, when you pretend there is another translation that justifies you. “Trust me,” said Joseph Smith, “Put you’re trust in me when I tell you that God chose me and that I speak his will and that these golden plates I translated and am hiding under this cloth really are under this cloth. And look at me, am I not beautiful, loving, and well spoken? And therefore I tell you the Bible has been corrupted and would support me if we had the originals and if those prophets weren’t so sinful and rebellious, unlike me. Trust my revision and divine interpretations of it, or else, you can’t be apart of the true church and you are going to Hell and you will never have the Spirit. Keep my covenants.” “Trust us,” said the Muslims, “Trust that Christianity is wrong because you’re Bible has been altered. It doesn’t preserve God’s word accurately, our Quran is superior, it’s better than the original. The original Bible would have supported what we say if there was a perfect copy. Those Jewish prophets couldn’t be trusted with the pen the Bible says. The real prophets were Muslims, Abraham wasn’t even Jewish.” And like them, you beg the world to believe in your invisible contradictory evidence too. You too are a cult, whose religion centers around mere men, and like Mormons, gods, gods you pretend to merely venerate. Like the Pharisees, the leaders of the Catholics withhold the knowledge of the keys to the kingdom of Heaven and give them false keys instead, your tradition, tradition that negates the word of God.
I’m chosen by grace, not by works, and the faith I have that saved me wasn’t of me, but of God. And remember: God’s will be done, on Earth, AS IT ALWAYS IS, in Heaven.
“Message: Thank you for your email and the opportunity to help you with your errors. I have a M.Div. from Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary and a PhD from Duke Divinity.”
Yet you fail in common sense and righteousness and here’s your failing grade (I’m referring to this reply/this journal post):
Ian Punnet has a Masters of Divinity degree from Columbia Theological Seminary in Atlanta and has been ordained a Deacon in the Episcopal Church. Since 1998, Punnett has intermittently hosted Coast to Coast AM and is loved by the world (and guess which group makes up the majority of the world Mr. Catholic?) and yet Ian Punnet is a heretic of the severe kind by the main sect of Catholicism and it’s many heretic daughters (the traditional Catholic branches and heretical “protestant” sects). But because Ian Punnet has a high and might education in Christianity and religion and listens to heretics babble all day for years while interviewing them, does that mean he isn’t a blind hypocrite and abomination in God’s eyes? Absolutely not according to Scripture: “You hate all who do wrong.” That’s is a severely oppositional verse to the Catholic and it’s Daughter the Episcopalian’s false potential convert pick-up line, “God loves you (join our Church now because we said everything is okay, and then we’ll ask you for some charity so we can repeat this line to others and get you to admit you’re a sinner like us so we can feel better about ourselves and more so by getting as many people to go to Hell with us as possible if that’s where we’re going.”
“I wrote my doctoral thesis comparing John Calvin’s “Institutes” with the writing of St. Augustine named “Confessions”. You might do some study as well.”
I already corrected you, and you ignore that correction and then pretend I didn’t study what I just corrected you on while citing evidence, which makes you a conniving hypocrite. Stop making backhanded insults you stubborn, malicious, idiot. And how man false doctoral theses are there in there world that have passed by the world’s standards with flying colors? And are you saying that those Baptists approved a heretical rant? If so, then they must have been pro-Catholics (rather than “Calvinist” Baptists as you imply). Or, are you saying you wrote something you believed to be false in your spiritual confusion? You’re trapped.
“Jesus said that His Church will never fall into apostasy and the Bible clearly states that the Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth” [and the Catholic church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth” Jesus said that His Church will never fall into apostasy and the Bible clearly states that the Church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth” [and the Catholic church is the “pillar and foundation of the truth” x infinity.”
In your schooling ignoramus, did they teach you logical fallacies? You’re obviously a cultist moron stuck in a circular reasoning loop. I suggest you study logical fallacies from your next of kin the atheists (who list them all over the net). Also, circular reasoning is something a spiritually unblind person can spot, hint hint.
“I would be very careful in calling the Word of God and Jesus liars if I was you.”“You seem to think of yourself as God”
A straw man of the malicious passive aggressive type. Stop hiding the raptists and child-molesters. And instead of telling me to be very careful about mishandling God’s word, why not obey your own advice hypocrite? Hint: don’t make insults that can simply be repeated back to you: that’s a pretty big hint that mere insults are not evidence of anything. Are you really unaware of something so basic late in your life?
Which is why I back up what I say with evidence and you merely accuse like Satan does :)
And who cares what “seems” to be real to a delusional babbler? Give evidence babbler, not your vague special Catholic who rejected the truth feelings.
Hypocrite much Mr. Accept the Pope Or Ur Going to Hell? So what were you saying about some man thinking he was God lol? Polytheist moron.
“and to be deeply delusional”
You’re mere rants and claims awesome evidence no matter how “deeply” you feel about it. Once again babbler: you’re feelings are not evidence of anything, nor hatred, nor insults. And moron, you’re not God Mr. Whatever I Feel and Say Is True, and moron, God isn’t merely right simply because he makes a claim, you don’t even understand truth right (of course a false Christian wouldn’t).
“if you really think you can know another’s heart.” … Which is why you made false claims about me and are calling the Bible a lie when it says that you can JUDGE A PERSON BY THEIR ACTIONS AND APPEARANCE you moron. Read and believe the Bible you ignore, twist and hate:
“Proverbs 13:5: The righteous hate what is false”, and of course you’re not righteous so you wouldn’t remember something like that. So then moron, is a person claiming to “know a person’s heart” when they say the righteous hate lies? NO MORON: SO YOU’VE LIED AND COMMITTED ANOTHER FALLACY, A MALICIOUS TYPE SINCE YOU’RE GOING AGAINST WHAT IS COMMONLY UNDERSTOOD, THAT YOU’RE NOT CLAIMING TO “KNOW A PERSON’S HEART” MERELY BY CLAIMING THAT THEY ARE BEING HATEFUL LIKE YOU DID TO ME, YOU BLIND HYPOCRITE. You’re also saying then that you don’t understand BASIC SCRIPTURE. You’re teachers must have not been paying attention when they passed you (something common these days in this corrupt world Mr. But I Studied Calvin and Augustine, therefore I Must Know What I’m Talking About And You Mustn’t!” Sure Mr. Pharisee. I think not.
“You seem to be completely consumed by irrational hatred and bigotry.” … if you really think you can know another’s heart.” Blind hypocrite apart of the Whore that Rides the Beast says what? Contradicting yourself in one breath (typical of blind, arrogant, hypocrites).
“When this is in league with intentional ignorance”
Wow: moron: LEARN WHAT EVIDENCE IS, IT’S NOT “MY INSULTS” IT’S NOT “MY EMOTIONS” IT’S NOT “MY MERE CLAIMS”. I suggest you do some studying reality-hater (and God-hater).
“it is a recipe for the death of one’s soul to Christ.”
And pretentious insults really make you “righter” right child-molester-hider? Wrong.
“Are you aware of the Decalogue that forbids the bearing of false witness against others”
Are you aware of the Catholic Bible’s that remove the law to not make idols and that “Don’t lie” is in the Bible Mr. Christoper Columbus Church of Basic Right and Wrongs Those Protestants Don’t Know Cuz We’re The True Church? Are you aware that the Jesus rebuked the most popular religious leaders of his time for negating GOD’S WORD WITH “TRADITION”? Are you aware that the Bible says “Isaiah 29:13: The Lord says: “These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is based on merely human rules they have been taught.“? So merely READING AND REPEATING SCRIPTURE DOESN’T MAKE YOU RIGHTEOUS. BIG, MASSIVE, CHRISTIANITY AND COMMON SENSE 101. And are you also aware that Jesus said,
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them.” (Matthew 7:15-16)? Yet the Catholic DisUnified Church negates his words with it’s malicious “everyone sins :)” line. Stop being a broken record, cultist parrot and a vain, malicious, liar.
“and that doing so is a mortal sin?”
And whatever they delusional false Christians claim is true is true because they said so. Not.
Are you a narcissist Mr. Obviously?: http://narcissism.tk You should really study the signs of narcissism disorder Mr. Obviously Whatever I Say Is True Merely Because I Said It Is and Found Others Who Agree With Me (While I Can’t Cite Any of God’s Word That Backs Me Up On That).
“you either do not or have no fear of God”
And on and on the Catholic goes citing no Scripture and ranting his insults as if that makes him right (typical behavior of a cultist and prideful sore loser).
“that prevents you from this mortal sin.”
You love saying “mortal sin” don’t you? How about understanding and preaching the truth rather than phrases you find to be catchy?
“You seem to be consumed in an effort to do and spread evil.”
Say what about knowing my heart? Insults in ignorance x infinity (typical cultist).
“May our Lord have mercy on you. God bless!”
With their mouths they bless and hearts they curse.
Because you said so.
Neat, you’re a “Friar”. Were you one of the ones that helped Robin Hood to rob “the rich”, or do you spend your time robbing the poor? Or is it both?
More of the Endless Evidence for Catholic Polytheism (Evidence from CatholicNews.com)